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Mark Dolfini on Landlord Coaching 



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Gary Pinkerton hosts Mark Dolfini, the founder of Landlordcoach.com. Mark explains his journey into real estate and explains why he prefers single-family homes over multifamily properties. He goes into the importance of valuing your time and using it efficiently. He ends with some tips for putting systems in place when running a business.

Announcer 0:04
Welcome to the heroic investing show. As first responders we risk our lives every day our financial security is under attack. Our pensions are in a state of emergency. A single on duty incident can alter or erase our earning potential instantly and forever. We are the heroes of society. We are self reliant and we need to take care of our own financial future. The heroic investing show is our toolkit of business and investing tactics on our mission to financial freedom.

Gary Pinkerton 0:39
Hello, and welcome to Episode 155 of the heroic investing show. This is a podcast for active duty members of the military, first responders, veterans and anyone looking to improve their financial future and gain some freedom with their time. Today we have the distinct pleasure to talk with marine veteran Mark Delphine. Mark is an author a speaker, a coach and real estate investor in multifamily that he directly owned for many years even dating back to when he was in college at Purdue University. He’s a Indiana native has lived there most of his life currently lives in Lafayette mark is pretty much killing it on the speaker, author, and coaching circuit and runs a lot of multifamily and does a tremendous job in his niche and his niche is coaching landlords, right? I’m not sure I’ve ever met a landlord, coach, they may exist out there, I’ve not come across them. But being a landlord, I could use a coach. And so I have no doubt he has a phone that’s ringing off the hook and a calendar that’s full. Mark is just an incredibly inspiring individual. I walked away from this conversation, knowing that he can help a lot of people. We talk about his book, his most recent book, you know, I don’t want to spoil it by covering it here in the introduction. But I think you’re really going to gain a tremendous amount in this conversation with Mark. So as I mentioned, a veteran and I got his Bachelor of Science in accounting from Purdue University, he managed over $40 million in real estate. But the best part of Mark’s story is why he ended up focusing on coaching landlords to be successful, it’s because the world kind of fell apart for him around the 2008 crisis. But mostly for him, it was about not having the ability to have enough time to do things because he had no systems in place and was doing everything himself. I think every one of us can look in the mirror and see a marked ofany inside us, right? I can today. And I’ve ran a nuclear submarine and a crew of 150 people in harm’s way and done things that you would think I wouldn’t get caught up running a one man financial services business. But I do. And I think we all kind of get in our own way. I understand the ability to leverage and delegate, but it still is challenging for me. So I asked you to, you know, listen up to mark, consider, you know, going to his website and reading his book and thinking about his mark the right guy who maybe should be coaching you. So I found him really, really engaging. I know I can learn from Mark, and I think you can do so please sit back and listen to a great interview here with Mark, Yogi. Well, everyone, thanks so much for joining us again here on the Heroku investing show. And as I said in the introduction, we have a tremendous pleasure of having marked off any with us here from Indiana. And what’s got that wrong mark. And Mark Mark will talk about in a moment here how he ended up there in Indiana, like many of us, we at school just kind of got stuck, I think and I don’t know, I forgot to ask Mark if he grew up in the Midwest like I did. And all of you listeners probably by now know that I grew up on a small dairy farm in Southern Illinois and hadn’t been back for many years. But I think I’ve made three trips to Indiana. In fact, I was in Indianapolis last weekend and didn’t mention that to mark. I got to enjoy lots of beautiful Midwestern rain while I was supposed to be watching a NASCAR event which didn’t happen. But you know, as we just passed by the 911, incredible memorials here on the east coast. Can’t help but appreciate having the opportunity to have a Marine Corps veteran, a Marine, always a marine onboard with us, Mark, thanks so much for joining us. And if you would, please just kind of refresh a little bit your story for us.

Mark Dolfini 4:15
Yeah, well, first of all, thanks for having me on. It’s a distinct pleasure to speak. But another bet and certainly props to you as a Submariner. I think that is a world that I just don’t even understand. And I’m not that smart. And I don’t know that I ever could understand so. So my hat’s off to you, sir. But I came to my story here in the Midwest, I got out of the Marine Corps in 1997. And remember, I was telling the story last night to a group of people about how I was signing off one last time I was a celestial navigator, attached to a C 130 tactical error Air Refueling Squadron. And it was bittersweet because I had about 2000 hours in that airframe. But my time was coming to a close because I decided to leave the Marine Corps and Go to Purdue to pursue my education. So it was bittersweet, but it was also a new chapter. It was very, very exciting. So leaving, leaving the Marine Corps and came here to go to Purdue, and this new yorker was becoming a Hoosier, and I always kid my fellow Hoosiers here, I say we need to do better at the onboarding process. Because Because I’m not really sure what it is that we put on pizza. She’s pretty sure that that is cruel and unusual punishment. But we do have biscuits and gravy. So there’s a trade off, right?

Gary Pinkerton 5:29
Yeah, I just did that Chicago style with my sons in downtown Indianapolis. I can’t remember the name of the company. But it is that it’s a chain that’s in Chicago as well. I used to go there when I was a kid. After 30 years, it tastes different. And my kids are like that, what is this stuff? I just remembered as being the coolest pizza on Earth. So your tastes change, I guess they do evolve. That’s right.

Mark Dolfini 5:51
So coming from New York being used to New York pizza and coming here to the Midwest, it’s been good. But I but I did I did. You said in the intro, I ended up staying here because the cost of living is just hard to beat. And the people are amazing. And the really, what really got me started in in business here was during my time, as a produce student I was I had this secret love on the side, which was real estate, and being an entrepreneur and doing my own thing. So by the time I had graduated from Purdue, I wasn’t quite 20 years old yet, but I had about a half million dollars worth of real estate that I had purchased about which amounted to about a dozen rental units. So that’s, that’s where things started to get interesting.

Gary Pinkerton 6:29
So many of our investors are gonna, you know, resonate with that, that comment you just made, I have a CPA and investor that I have followed for years. And he makes this comment that if you just buy one rental property every year or two, you know, something kind of small, you’re just saving the majority of money there, when you get to what you know, is traditional retirement and my listeners are tired of me hearing me say I don’t think you should retire, I don’t think it’s healthy. I think that’s a concept that should go away. Nonetheless, when you get into your 60s after having worked for several years, and just kind of squirreling away money on these properties, that from time to time, maybe you’re a bit of a pain, you look back and you realize, man, half those things are paid off, their cash flowing all nicely. And there’s, you know, a couple dozen of them. And all of a sudden you set a really lucrative and uncorrelated to the markets, cash flow, you know, that can kind of carry off into the sunset, if you want to make that happen. Now, you’ve kind of taken a different approach, and you kind of jumped a little headlong into property management for several years,

Mark Dolfini 7:26
right? Well, what I did was I did follow that approach for quite a while. And in really, property management almost came out of necessity, but it was a natural fit for what I was doing. So to jump into the story, the reason why like buying the individual properties, one or two, maybe a year, obviously it was a little bit faster than that. But the reason I like the single family as opposed to the multifamily is the fact that it’s if you have to liquidate properties, it’s so much easier to liquidate a unit versus trying to find a buyer for a 16 unit apartment building.

Gary Pinkerton 8:00
And you can sell it to somebody who wants to live in it. Right, exactly.

Mark Dolfini 8:02
So you have a whole realm of buyers, which is not just investors, but you can also if it’s a decent house, sell it to someone who wants to live in it as either a starter home or, or whatever, whatever the market you happen to be in. But that was a strategy that had worked well for me. And as I was building that portfolio up, I had gotten to 92 rental units, which is about $6 million worth of real estate. The problem that I have, which I’ll talk certainly more about in depth here in a little while. But the problem that I had was I never set that up to be sustainable. I never set that up as a business. So as I grew the units from one to 10, to 20, to 35 to 75 to 92. Yeah, I was bringing in over $60,000 a month in revenues. But my life was complete and total hell, because I never replaced myself from doing all the work. And I mean, everything from leasing and showing and cleaning and painting and rent collection and bank deposits and everything. It was just absolute madness. So really that was the problem is that and when I wrote the time wealthy investor, that was really what I wanted to address was I was so time weary that I got to be timing bankrupt. And I just I never, ever replaced myself from doing that job. You know that and it was the worst paying job ever. I just was never off 20 hour days punishing back to back days, you know, seven days a week. I couldn’t even afford to get sick. So when I had my Hindenburg moment and 2008 and 2009 came along and shook the snow globe up on everybody. I ended up losing about four and a half million dollars in real estate probably in about six months. And that’s when things really got real for me because I felt like I was losing everything that I had built for the previous, you know, 1012 years was in jeopardy and literally felt like it was all for nothing.

Gary Pinkerton 10:00
So this was 2008 2009 Why did that happen? What we overleveraged? Or what, you know, looking back on it, what was the big point?

Mark Dolfini 10:07
As an aeronautical guy, you know, I’d love to say this was this was the thing, but, you know, if you look at like most aeronautical, you know, air accidents, it’s always a series of events. Sure, right. It’s not a one thing, rarely, you know, it’s not like wing falls off, you know, it’s usually, you know, 15 things up to that. And in my particular case, was was similar, where I, whenever there was a job, I never ever learned to value my time. So, you know, if I was doing work that, you know, cuz I’m very handy too. So I could fix a lot of things. So if it meant that I would go and fix a furnace, which my time might be valued at 30 or $40 an hour fixing furnaces, I would turn right around and go and, you know, paint an apartment, which is, you know, eight to $10 an hour work, right. I never valued my time highly enough. So as a result, I was sometimes I was paying myself $30 an hour, sometimes I was paying myself $8 an hour. And that was the real problem, because I never recognized that soon enough. So that if there was a fundamental problem, I would say it was really more of a mindset. But I just kept on creating this job for myself more and more jobs by bringing on more and more units that I was over leveraged, not just financially, but I was over leveraged in time. I never learned to value my free time. And that was the problem. And I think, especially with military guys and first responders, I think that is the biggest problem with with with us is that, you know, a real quick story. When I went to Purdue, a guy had said to me, I was taking a full load, and I had a full time job. Not to mention the few rental units that I had, that I was buying more. So I really had like two and a half jobs. And I remember this, this vet that was there, he said to me, he was I don’t know why we feel like we need to do this to ourselves, you know, like being a Baron. And I said that absolutely. You know, I was absolutely doing this to myself. But the real challenge there was learning to back out of that, and, you know, plays get someone else in those positions that could do that more and work for me. So I could go on and do things that were higher and better use of my time.

Gary Pinkerton 12:10
Yeah, you know, I’m in that same situation right now. I’m just now starting to pass off quite, you know, a substantial amount of the stuff that I’m doing. I’ve been working 20 hour days, far harder than I did command in a nuclear submarine. And I’m getting caught on silly little things like, you know, I find a person that I like is a virtual assistant. And then they say, you know, well, can you give me like the operating agreement? Or the operating instructions? Or the instruction manual? I’m like, all right, I don’t have that yet. I mean, I know you need one. But then that’s the small little pebble that stops the rolling tank, right? It’s like, it’s just enough that I’m like, Okay, I’ll get to that in a month or two. And now Meanwhile, I’m still swimming in the deep end, trying to keep my head above, right. So I’m sure you run across that all the time. I guess the answer is you have to go slow for a while to be able to go faster in the end,

Mark Dolfini 12:56
right. And that’s really it. Because what it’s not even about being slow. It’s about being intentional, and valuing your time. And I think and I know I’m saying the same thing. And maybe I just need to say in different ways. so other people can understand that. But that is something that is so important. Because when you know, for example, we’re doers, we’re action people like just by default. That’s why what made us successful. What made us successful in the military, and as a first responder is not necessarily going to be the skill that makes us successful as an entrepreneur. And just because we have a good work ethic does not mean that we have to do all the work, or and that’s the thing, right? So I want to make sure that people understand that it’s okay to have a good work ethic, it’s okay to even in the beginning to do a lot of that work. But sooner than later, you need to place a value on your free time, or someone else will.

Gary Pinkerton 13:50
Yeah, it’s just that sometimes there’s hurdles to get over. And you know, I think there’s there’s stages like you, you come as a salaried individual from the military or often from first responders as well, right? So you’re paid an amount. And often you’re paid kind of that salary, whether you’re there or not. So you always kind of find opportunities, free time to fix the thing in the house or to mow the lawn or whatever, right. And then and then when you transition out, what I find for most people is that they’re still do it yourselfers. And then you come to this point where you realize, you know, you have an awesome coach like yourself that runs this little strategy for you. Well, how much you want to make this year? What do you realize on a normal work, how many how many hours a week you want to work and you go do the math and you realize, gosh, if I’m doing anything for under 100 bucks an hour, I should have somebody else do it because I can make that money elsewhere. Right. It’s a great, that’s a very powerful discussion. And I get that and I have that internalized. And I think a lot of people do too. And when it comes to like mowing the lawn, well some dude is mow your neighbor’s yard you’re like, Hey, you want to mow mine? And then you got it solves right. But then you get to the next level. You get to the next level and it’s like, well, can you spend a half a day to write a manual and interview me and explain this and do it with me and so there’s there’s a lot you know, there’s becomes this low hanging fruit That you can get rid of, then the next level is, I think it’s probably needing somebody like yourself to help provide some advice on how do you do the stuff where you’re gonna have to work for zero dollars an hour for a while to put together stuff so that you can hand off the $30 an hour?

Mark Dolfini 15:15
successful, right? Exactly right, it goes to one of those things just because we tend to be doers. And that gets to be problematic, because Is it easier to let’s just pretend that you have a subordinate that comes up to you that reports to you? And is it easier to just answer the question and get them out of your hair? Yeah, of course it is. Right? When you when you would take that 35 or 45 seconds to answer the question, and never actually train them to say, Well, okay, what do you think? Let’s stop. And you know, Now, of course, you know, when you’re if you’re in a, you know, a firefight, you know, and like, you don’t have time to do that, like, there’s no time like, Well, what do you think you should when you reload? You know, it’s not? Of course, there’s not, that’s not what I’m talking about when I’m talking about is having whitespace in your world. So you can take that time to do that. So you can’t do that when you’ve got 92 rental units, and you’re everything around you is on fire, right? I can’t, I basically created the worst situation for myself. And honestly, I wouldn’t go back to that. I mean, I was making money hand over fist. I mean, but it almost killed me. It literally almost killed me, I wound up in a hospital with double pneumonia as a 37 year old man that was always very, very healthy. Yeah. So I’m telling you, this has become my passion. Because I don’t want people to become so time weary that they get into the game. And then they get in the rental properties. And they I hear all complaining that goes on with residents and all the drama that can go around that. But I’m telling you, and I want people to really internalize this and really find the truth in this statement is that nearly every time I hear someone complain about a resident, it’s almost always a problem of infrastructure or process that was created by the business owner. Yeah,

Gary Pinkerton 17:02
no doubt. So Mark, who is your best? Who’s your ideal coaching clients?

Mark Dolfini 17:06
Well, really, I call them arpeggios. And that’s a rental property operator. Okay, right. So so that could be a landlord, it could be a property manager, because I’ve got I’ve got experiences both. But really, it’s someone who really is open to coaching, open to recognizing that it’s not a, I tried coaching for a session or two, and it didn’t work. I’m not a tips and tricks guy. I am someone that’s going to come in and walk in and give a holistic overview in terms of where they want to go in life, and why that’s important to them. Because I’ll tell you what, when you walk into a trash department the first time and you go, oh my god, this is such a disaster, because it’ll happen. Now, I don’t care how good your strategy is, and your processes, that’s going to happen. But if you’ve got a rock solid vision for what the mission is, and what the goal is, and you go, I don’t care, I want to be able to sit on a beach, you know, four years from now rubbing cocoa butter on my belly, right? There’s nothing that’s going to get in the way you just go, you know what, let’s get it cleaned up and move on. And you just keep on going. So working through that vision, setting up that infrastructure and outlining those processes is really what I do, but it takes time to get there. So someone that’s open to coaching, but is specifically what I refer to as that rental property operator.

Gary Pinkerton 18:22
Yeah, that’s awesome. I did an interview in the audience, I think probably remembers with Colonel lane being he’s an Air Force Colonel f 16. pilot, and he’s running a bunch of multifamily. It’s called pilot properties down in Dallas. And he’s got this incredible vision, written vision statement, that is everyone in his company works works towards and when you were talking about, if you got a clear vision, the speed bumps don’t bother you, you know, I think he’s really got that going in the real estate world very well. And I was always impressed. And he’s a very close friend of mine. And I just love talking to people who had that kind of a vision in any company, but certainly in real estate world. And I was reflecting back on, you know, I asked like, what did you know, learn and bring from the Marine Corps? I always asked my, you know, my guests that question. I think this is the first time where we’ve really talked about a really good observation. That is sometimes what we bring, which is a really strong work ethic. I mean, I think that’s generically what most people bring, if you had to put little checks in the boxes of the qualities of this first responder or retired first responder or veteran, it would be that they have incredible work ethic, they show up on time, they work forever, they’ll work long. The interesting thing is that we’ve kind of highlighted here that this can actually work against you because other people are going to give up quicker and they’re going to get help. And we’re going to keep pushing through it until we’re so buried in it with so many properties and so far down the rabbit hole, it’s gonna be hard to find your way out of the rabbit hole.

Mark Dolfini 19:48
Right. And I think really, my background specifically as a celestial navigator. I mean, one of the things that I look back at when I was getting out was I had a very clear vision For my objective, you know, like I knew what the objective was. And I think that that’s what, that’s the thing I think I took out of the Marine Corps to say, you know what, and you know that military precision is often anything but precise. Right? Yeah.

Gary Pinkerton 20:15
Especially celestial navigation.

Mark Dolfini 20:17
And I was a celestial navigator in the days when when GPS was not that abundant. But really, it was about, hey, did the mission get accomplished, and sometimes it just did not look pretty. But it got there. That’s probably the big lesson that I took away is to say, you know what, perfection is really way overrated. But excellence is good. Excellence is often way better than what most people can bring to the table. So what I would say is, don’t shoot for perfection, don’t get hung up in the perfection trap. Because, you know, when you’re on an airplane, the airplane speeding up terra firma, I mean, you’re just you’re going over it, you know, at 300 knots, and there’s no slowing it down. I mean, you’ve got to stay up with the airplane. And that’s probably one of the biggest things I learned is you know, what sometimes just doesn’t look pretty. Sometimes you just get it to where you got to get to. And again, it wasn’t just always celestial navigation. Sometimes we’re doing low level flight, and aerial deliveries and all the other stuff and aerial refueling, and then all the other stuff that we were doing. But sometimes it just didn’t look pretty. But the at the end of the day, what was the mission that was accomplished? That right there? What is the mission? What is the vision, that’s what you need to know. And that’s something that has to come from internal, because now you’re the one, you’re the general, you’re the one setting the vision, you’re the ones setting the mission. And a lot of guys I know, it almost seems like their mission and their vision is just to be really, really busy. And if that’s what you want by, but I can tell you, there’s a better life out there than just you know, working to live, you know, or written or living to work rather, you know, we all have to work.

Gary Pinkerton 21:48
Yeah, and most, most veterans, most first responders got into our business, because we have a bigger vision in life, right? We want to serve other people. Obviously, we want to help our family, we want to have a good life, we always look forward towards improving our own situation. The most of us are out there wanting to contribute to a charity wanting to go around the world and help out in disaster relief or something, it takes time to do that. And so at the beginning of every show that I’ve done on the heroic investing, I’ve talked about how that’s my vision to help people put in place things like passive income, and get more clear on what their purpose in life is. So they stop wasting time and get time back with their family. Right. So we’re certainly very aligned. You’re, I think, more strategic, or more tactical, I guess, I would say, the wrong phrase, more tactical, on specifically fixing the individual fixing their process, so that they free up that time immediately. I’m more on the kind of conceptual like, what should you do? And why does passive income help? What changes? Does it help make sure certainly aiming towards the same goal, though?

Mark Dolfini 22:49
Yeah, definitely. I think it’s just I think it’s the same path. It’s just different ends of it, when and where I see, like, right now I have a property management business that basically runs itself. I mean, I have employees, they are amazing at what they do. Everybody knows their job. And it’s not this chaotic mess that people walk into. Yeah, we’re gonna make mistakes. Of course, we’re gonna make mistakes. But we have really good systems and processes. And almost always when we screw up, it’s because we didn’t follow the system or processes in place. You know, we got lazy, but the mistakes we’re making are not these gigantic mistakes. There are mistakes of Oh, yeah, I forgot to, you know, check the checklist item on that one thing, you know, and it’s usually stuff that’s usually pretty small. So the mistakes are,

Gary Pinkerton 23:35
yeah, as long as they care, as long as they understand the culture and follow the culture, right, then it’s just a training thing in the submarine force training is that one thing that we always focused primarily on I mean, operations, repairs, maintenance, assuming it wasn’t an emergency, would always take backseat to training, we’d stopped doing that stuff to go to train, because we realize that when a mistake is made, in any organization really comes down, you can distill it down to one or two things. Either the person doesn’t care, like they know what the requirement is, and they don’t care. And we’ve got a way to get rid of those, especially in the military, right, and in a company too. But if they do care, and they understand, then it’s just simply that the training wasn’t good, either. They didn’t listen, or you didn’t provide it effectively, or you didn’t provide it often enough, right? That’s easy to solve. If a person cares, and you got a system, it’s easy to train to the system, right?

Mark Dolfini 24:24
That’s exactly right. And you’re bringing up a very valid point that I wrote about in the time wealthy investor, I came up with this behavioral model called the PE model process expectations behavior. In my model here I teach, you know, vision in terms of where they want to go, then infrastructure, which is the bones of the business, that’s what the, you know, it’s the websites. It’s the it’s the office space, it’s the bones of the business, if you will, then it’s process and process. You know, if you think of infrastructure as the train tracks, process as the train and process pulls two cars, and it’s processed expectations, behavior, and the behavior model is just exactly as you discussed. Most times when you’re getting behavior That you don’t want to say in this example would be from your tenants or from your residence, you want to go and attack the behavior. But first and foremost, you have to say, Wait, hang on a second, that the behavior was they didn’t mow the lawn, or the behavior was they didn’t pay the rent on time. You have to say, hold on, let’s let’s look at this, you know, it’s the tail wagging the dog let’s look at Do they understand the process of paying rent? Did they understand that they could pay for the website, they can mail it in that they can drop it off and drop it, you know, whatever, whatever your processes for accepting rent, but it’s got to be a clear delineation, in terms of what that process is, then do they understand the expectation? Right now I’m using a very simple example. But it’s powerful. What if they understand the process, and they understand the expectation that the rent has to be paid by a certain date, or this is what’s going to happen? Then when you get to the behavior, there’s very simple techniques to how to handle their behavior, you know, like, not taking on their drama, and making sure that you’re speaking to them in a way that’s that is going to get you to do the required objective. So it really exactly what you said is I mean, you have to assume that they have to care because if they don’t care, it’s like, Okay, if I’m just going to victim get definitely done with you. But, but if assuming they do care, which, you know, because getting evicted is a headache, then you just it’s processed expectation for hungry. And you just explained that way. Now, again, this is I explained that three minutes where it takes several weeks to understand the how deep it goes. But it is delayed in my book.

Gary Pinkerton 26:20
So let’s talk a little bit more about that. Because I think you’ve piqued the interest of many listeners from heroic investing. So you’ve got a book time wealthy investor, which I love that title. Certainly, there’s some nuggets in that in that book, just based on the title and what you’ve talked about, but you have a new book coming out and you had kind of an offer for the audience. So kind of tie that into also just how they can find out more,

Mark Dolfini 26:40
nobody. Great, thank you. Well, the time wealthy investor, I wrote that last year, and publish that in July of 2017. So I’m, as I was teaching the seminars, I recognized that I wanted to bring the book more into alignment with the seminars, so that way, if you couldn’t quite make the seminar, you couldn’t quite afford it, that you would get very much the same training by buying the book and it gets you pretty close. It doesn’t get you all the way that you get in the coaching and seminars, but it brings you pretty deep otherwise I could I had to cut it off at some point. It’s a 300 page book. So people don’t read very many books these days that are that long. So I want to make sure that was still valuable. But in the time wealthy investor 2.0, that’s actually getting ready to be released very soon, on October 13. So it will be available for purchase on Amazon. But I also wrote a book this year, which I’m willing to give away for free to your listeners, as a download. It’ll be available at landmark coach comm Ford slash hero. And I’ll say that here in a second, but it’s called the judge. And it’s an 80 page book that is really meant to help pique the interest of the reader and understand what can happen if you’re not if you end up being and becoming time weary. And that’s when you’re not in control of your calendar. So it’s meant to be a fast read, it’s only 80 pages, I will give that away as a free download that like I said again, landlord coach.com, forward slash zero. Awesome,

Gary Pinkerton 28:03
thank you, how can they find out more just go to landlord coach calm is that the best way to reach out to you or to find out more about your company?

Mark Dolfini 28:10
Yeah, I offer a free coaching session, it’s really more of a discovery session, I can’t really do much coaching with someone if I’m just learning about them. But it’s about an hour or so it says 30 minute, but generally I like to plan for a little bit longer just so that way I can actually give them some things to work on things to think about. And and give them some value, even if we don’t wind up being being a client because it really does matter to me that people don’t go down the road that I went down, I’m telling you that was living hell. And what ends up happening is people end up in a really bad places not only financially, but they become emotionally bankrupt, because they’re putting a lot of blood, sweat and tears in this and then for them to walk away. And, you know, seven 810 years down the road and then get hit with, you know, the recapture the depreciation recapture and all the things that are just not good. From a tax perspective. You know, it really, it just doesn’t make sense to me. So I want to make sure that people don’t head down that road, and are being very deliberate, very intentional about the business that they’re trying to create. So yeah, reach out to me. I’m happy to have a discussion and I certainly look forward to it.

Gary Pinkerton 29:14
That’s awesome. Well, Mark, thanks so much for joining us here on the heroic investing show that that has been an incredible, large list of insights that you provide us, you know, in your career to time.

Mark Dolfini 29:24
Well, thanks so much. It was really this is a lot of fun, and I looking forward to seeing everyone’s success. This has been there’s been a really good time. Thanks so much.

Gary Pinkerton 29:30
Awesome. Bye bye.

Jason Hartman 29:33
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